2007 / May 9th/ Wordpress community, we gotta talk
For the most part, I love the Wordpress community. I love the passion, the selflessness and the creativity that spurs from it. It’s the reason that Hemingway has been primarily developed for WP. I felt like Hemingway was my little chance to give back to the community.
But that relationship has gotten more and more sour over the past year and a half. What started off as an unexpected success has turned into a bratty little kid. You see, at first I was amazed at how many people loved and used Hemingway. But recently, I’ve started to wish less people used it. I even considered taking down the support forums, download pages, and instantly marking anything with “Hemingway” in the subject like Junk-mail.
Why?
The community has a dark side
The reason is the dark side of the Wordpress community. Especially surrounding theme developers. There’s a couple sides to this story, and not all of them are users. I feel like I released Hemingway during the “golden era” of theme development: a time when all things were good and right in the blogosphere.
Nasty Theme Developers
I’m not going to lie: a lot of my disheartening comes from fellow “developers.” It all started with a bit of an unexpected benefit of developing a template. From that point, we’ve progressed to the point of people selling linkbacks in Templates. They call it “sponsored”, but what they really mean is cheap trick.
I’m going to be blunt: this is fucking unbelievable to me. It takes theme development from an art to a link-farm factory.
Nasty Theme Users
The other half of the equation are users that have complete disregard for… well, people. Here’s an example email I received earlier today:
Hi
my name is julien I have a blog on worpress and I use your Wonderfull hemingway Theme… it’s so nice!
I would love to remove the copyritghts and theme links at the end of the page. I wrote to wordpress support and they told me that I need to edit the CSS. I tried to do something but unfortunatly I’m not very good in CSS and it did’nt work. can you help for that? thanks for you attention best
Now I have no problem with people removing credits in the bottom (hence the MIT-style license), but don’t ask me to help you to remove my credit using a technology that’s probably the most documented on the internet.
Despite a gigantic yellow box (pictured below), I get emails daily asking for support for things ranging from how to change a background image, to asking permission to use Hemingway in a certain method. For about a year I was nice and replied to these questions — all of which can be answered in the support forums, or in the included license file for Hemingway. But after a year of the same questions, and exponential increase in the frequency of said questions: I’ve had it. I completely ignore people. I feel a little bit bad, but you know what — if people don’t have the common courtesy to respect my time, I will not respect theirs.
Lost Hope
It’s because of this dark side that Hemingway hasn’t seen any updates — including a painfully easy update to work with Wordpress 2.1 (renaming of a single function). It’s on purpose, and I realized it’s not laziness or lack of motivation — it’s out of spite. That’s a terrible way to think of your creation, but I’m afraid to say it’s true.
Themes need a rebirth
We need a rebirth of themes. Matt discussed how the plugin community has prospered by requiring a GPL (I would hope at minimum). I personally think it’s a great idea. We need a central repository for themes; that way themes are tied to Wordpress and not theme authors. It would go a long way towards restoring my hope if I didn’t have to link back to my name when/if I ever create a theme again.
Disclaimer
This is not to say that I have not met extraordinary people because of Hemingway. For the number of negative, annoying users there have been 10 fold grateful and pleasant users who ask reasonable questions and show respect for others.
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May 9th | #
Do you think how you are feeling is this a little bit like the celebrity who uses the newspapers to become famous, and then a few years later get riled that people are still actually taking photographs of them? “How dare they invade my privacy!”
All success is fraught with disadvantages.
May 9th | #
If you think you get a lot of emails for a theme, imagine what I get for WordPress! ;)
I’ve written quite a bit about sponsored themes, I think they’re distasteful at best and I think we’re on the right track for pushing them out.
As for the support issue, the good news is that it’s mostly a function of UI. Providing fewer ways of getting help or not updating the theme isn’t going to help, just the opposite, however there are ways to group, frame, and arrange things to help the greatest number of people help themselves or each other. You’re not going to fix the problem of the Juliens of the world, but at least you won’t be punishing good people for the sake of avoiding the occasional idiot.
May 9th | #
Separate your love (or hate) for your creation from the opinions of those that use it. I’d suggest you go on advancing Hemingway if you care to do so, and like you’ve already done ignore all requests for support. Heck, your Hemingway download page should have your big yellow disclaimer on it :-)
I like your theme, and I thank you for creating it. I’ve actually learned a lot more about CSS because of your theme (and web site in general) and thanks for that as well.
May 9th | #
Send back this to any hemingway queries: “If you would like to purchase support for this product, the rate is $80 an hour, minimum one hour.” and the relevant details.
May 9th | #
Kyle, I totally agree with the reasons you’ve listed above. WordPress, as good as it is is starting to run over some speed-bumps as of recent. I’ve even contemplated a switch to Expression Engine for something a little different..
May 9th | #
Maybe you should set up an autoresponder for your emails that sends if Hemingway is in the subject. Something to the effect of here is the forum, if your question isn’t answered google is your friend. Then add in the $80 an hour comment, I love that.
May 9th | #
[...] Neath of Warpspire has come out and expressed his feelings in concern to the WordPress community saying simply that he [...]
May 9th | #
You do great work, Kyle! Don’t let the bastards get you down!!
May 9th | #
amazing how the general idea of sharing can be threathened by a few selfish people… just like peace is threathened by a little violence. it is always disheartening to feel like there’s no point in having things be fair and controlled by the honor system only to see others exploit it.
BUT
i feel it is of the highest importance to not fall prey to cynicism!
we’re the good guys, and we are so BECAUSE we are selfless when others are opportunistic, and we know how to share and not be assholish about things.
i admire people like matt and yourself that spend time and effort making things for the community at large and i hope to earn my place amongst the good guys by doing my share. thank you and please know that while we all need money, most of us realize that more important is the dissemination of information and the empowering of individuals to grow.
thanks again!
May 9th | #
I haven’t checked or anything about this but possibly by making a FAQ for Hemingway and an auto-reply to any emails regarding it should have a link to the FAQ. Meh.
I’ve used Hemingway for a blog and was very happy with my experience with it. I never had one question that I couldn’t figure out myself and I even made my own (what is it?) style (I think) for it.
The problem I had with it was the un-originality of having it. You could spend half an hour on the internet and find at least five blogs with Hemingway installed. So I decided that I would change. Which is depressing because I liked Hemingway so much, but so did many other people.
I agree with you, though, that you shouldn’t do another theme. It just means more hairs you’ll never grow back.
I may have supportforumfobia because of all the people asking the same questions. I guess you know how that feels and its finally gotten to you too.
Thanks for the good content,
Austin
May 10th | #
Kyle, I’m sorry to hear you feel this way about Hemingway. It’s a fantastic WordPress theme and you should continue to be proud of your work on it.
I think by providing the theme for free in the first place, you’ve done a massive service to the community. If I were in your position and people wanted assistance in customising Hemingway, I’d charge for it as Courtenay said above.
Maybe you don’t want to do that, but I’d consider it a valid option.
May 10th | #
Mr. Kyle, I really respect your decent effort that you’ve put into Hemingway and its users, in fact I’m a huge fan of it and I’d like to say I’m a purist Hemingway user, and I hope those users won’t get to you. Please keep up the great work.
Haitham
May 10th | #
Yes, exactly - I’ve done free, never sponsored, themes for a couple of years, offered on various sites - so far only 3 threats of legal action due to opinions expressed on sites with our link in the footer…
(To be fair, these aren’t from the “WordPress community”)
May 10th | #
Hi,
I know exactly what you feel like. And, at times it frustrates me as well. But, unfortunately, sponsored themes has become a big market and we can’t stop it. I like the initiative that Matt has taken to stop the sponsored themes off WordPress.
The sponsored themes has become a really immoral business when the theme authors don’t mention that the themes are sponsored.
Regarding user support… I’ve taken the same stand as you for emails. I just ignore them. I have support forums setup and anyone who is really interested can stop by there.
I even ignore comments asking for support inspite of a similar disclaimer on my blog as well as a “No support comments” on the submit button!
Just goes to show how lazy people can be.
However, let me add, I do hope that you continue development. It’s a stand I’ve taken. I wont let a few people get me down. I’ll continue giving for free to the community and continue releasing my WordPress work as GPL.
May 10th | #
Kyle,
I completely sympathize. I think I may have nagged you a few times myself. I do however acknowledge and value people’s time. In some ways I find the Hemingway Theme a wonderful starting point but have been creatively pressured to not use it because of its ubiquity.
I field many questions concerning Slideshow Pro and WordPress often where I know there is documentation with each of these products that often support their questions. I try and ask myself the validity of their questions and decide whether they are simply being lazy or they made a concerted effort to solve the problem before I ignore or try and answer them.
I completely understand your discouragement.
May 10th | #
Hey,
I believe that (request of all kinds of support) happens to everyone that either shares os writes about something usefull. I get loads of WP support request just because i mantain one of its i18n files.
Even though i have full pages dedicated to telling people i can’t direct them to good taichichuan teachers, everyday a few readers that refuse to read ask me for directions. Everyday a few people ask me to give acupuncture consultations over email, or to teach them a martial art on the internet (however weird that may sound).
So what i want to say is, don’t get discouraged. Hemingway is a work of art. Mind the art, the creativity, and the feeling you put into it by sharing. It is when i see works like yours that i wish i had studied design.
Keep up!
May 10th | #
Great work! Hemingway was one of the first themes that I used, I hope you have luck!
May 10th | #
Thanks for all the compliments guys, it really does mean a lot to me.
May 11th | #
You write of theme development as art; maintain that outlook. If Hemingway is art, you should make and remake it as you choose without heed to those who abuse your generosity. Spite is a terrible reason not to display your latest painting; it damages you far more than those who don’t get to see it.
May 11th | #
[...] is right to complain about the way he’s treated by ungrateful users of Hemingway, but I think he’s wrong to [...]
May 11th | #
Interesting that you wrote this very soon after this theme was released. Coincidence? I think he mentions Hemingway in the first line of his post.
May 11th | #
Scott: No, I wrote this very soon after I received the email quoted above. That’s the coincidence. I don’t see how Derek’s theme has any relation to this idea… that’s an example of exactly the kind of thing I love to see in the Wordpress community.
May 11th | #
Whew! :-)
May 12th | #
I think the only way for the future is to dump the whole Wordpress project, let all the kiddies and cheaters go down and restart with a whole new blog system, where we can begin from the start. with a better technology and the knowledge of a revolution, which gone wrong.
greez, yours Marcel
May 12th | #
Your worries are well founded, Kyle. WP is an impressive community and it still amazes me how far it has come. And your thoughts on nasty users and developers are true as well. With search engines rating sites based on link backs, it’s obvious why others wish to get as much attention as you have.
The difference is that as long as there is a web, there will be options. It’s a society that thrives on its freedom. So yeah, a sponsored theme is as welcome as a ‘Hemingway’. Personally, I don’t endorse this view but nothing come for free and even Hemingway has cost you time. How you prefer to disperse that cost depends on you as well. Pro-bono, link backs or simply buy-and-use. Hell, people have made a business out of ringtones and what-not!
You should sleep easy. Cheers for keeping Hemingway free and supported. It’s one of the reasons I keep coming back to Warpspire.
May 12th | #
Well supposedly Hemingway was ripped of from This Site. I wanted to bring that up because this guy says his site never ran on wordpress and his design is much older (pre-wordpress)… i of course would not have even believed him if he didn’t basicly send me an email telling me i ripped of his site (my site is built on hemmingway… go figure!) and was so angry about it. I figured if he was using hemmingway he would have no reason to be angry, but he was very angry.
Please tell me this guy is insane?
May 12th | #
Alex: That’s funny as hell. Considering that a) Hemingway is a much better design than that. And b) At the time Hemingway was created, his site looked like this: http://web.archive.org/web/20051201024853/http://deep-resonance.org/
May 12th | #
Good then. I really like Derek’s theme, too.
May 12th | #
Kyle: Yeah i figured. He was just so damn pushy about it i thought maybe it was something to it… not that i thought hemingway ripped it off, but he actually made me believe there had to of been some mix up. I realized he or someone else released that as a theme for another CMS platform. Not sure which one though but not WP.
And yes, Hemingway is a much better design. He claimed though his was much better of course. The thing hurts my eyes.
Anyway, sorry for temporarily hijacking the comments for this subject. And yes, i agree whole heartedly with your post. I work with WP themes constantly and make good money from it. I see though many people in the same business doing REDESIGNS of themes like hemingway almost every day and it really gets to me. I’ve even seen people just flatout sell the exact same theme or another free theme available for download all the time.
May 13th | #
I have used hemingway and hemingway variations many times on my blogs and must say its a great development for wordpress. It revolutioned themes and the coding of wordpress. But I see where your coming from and hope you decide not to remove hemingway or hemingway development. If anything sell off the development and theme to a new home.
Its a shame that one person or one group a people could ruin it so hard for the rest.
May 16th | #
Also, about Sponsored Themes. It wouldn’t be so bad if everyone wasn’t doing it. I believe they should have a different section for them instead of rejecting them completely because many of them are good designs that wouldn’t be released otherwise.
It’s a crappy business but it should be controlled rather then being killed.
But also it’s a little ridiculous that for many places, a simple link or copyright on the bottom of your theme brand it as being “sponsored”. I under stand ads and hidden links of course but i believe the author should get some credit. Many places won’t let you even do that… and i’ve even seen some that replace it with their link to their wordpress theme site!
May 17th | #
I’ll simply add that I, too, love and appreciate the theme. It’s extraordinary work, I’ve admired it for a long time, and I’d gladly contribute any reasonable amount of scratch you care to suggest if it would help persuade you to continue developing it.
May 21st | #
hemingway is a great theme, dont subestimate the publicity and all the pros, and get used with the cons – internet is filled with stupid people, so as the world
people suck, dont do it for then
do it for you
May 24th | #
[...] opened my eyes fully after reading this blog from warpspire.com the guy who did Hemingway Word Press [...]
May 30th | #
Look, we all love your themes, and I can round up and say they are the best created. Fine, say that you will charge for helping them do things to the theme BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DON’T STOP MAKING THEM!
When the inventor of the best wordpress theme says he will not make any more, that’s when the blog will become less popular, and being used, please don’t let it happen.
I’m probably going to write an article on this myself, don’t stop!
May 31st | #
Just thank you!
June 2nd | #
Hello Kyle,
I just wanted to thank your for a great Wordpress theme. Hemingway has always been one of my favourites.
Hopefully when you have the time and are in the mood you could continue to maintain Hemingway, it would be greatly appreciated by many.
Regards.
June 5th | #
Don’t let yourself be consumed by spite.
Either be generous or not, but spite will just burn you up.
Thanks for your generosity,
Mic
June 13th | #
Kyle, I’ve been having problems with my Hemmingway theme. I’m sure I read somewhere that it’d cook my dinner and tie my shoelaces, but I can’t find the relevant help text or plugin… erm… I mean to say, cheers heaps mate - it’s a great base that can be worked with very nicely. Don’t despair - just offer consultancy services :)
June 14th | #
man i just downloaded your hemingway theme and i love it.
thank you for your creation, it looks like what i was looking for and it is original in its design too (i mean you made stuff that isn’t seen in other themes, the bottom bar).
Sorry to hear you’ve been bothered by users and other theme developers:-)
I’m just one of those positive feedback users… thank you very mucho again, I love it.
No I wont ask for you to update it, nor do I wish it to be. I’m happy with what is given.
Cheers.
(I’m not even aware it could require an update!)
June 14th | #
I really enjoy the Hemingway theme. It was refreshing to find it among all the other themes. It really broke the mold.
June 16th | #
Please don’t stop your amazing work, though those crappy “sponsor developers” are out of look, feel and art of theme developing. One of the reason this “developments” came so far, was the opening of the wordpress theme viewer to everybody: now everyday junk themes are appearing. Pity.
June 27th | #
Hi Kyle,
just love your Hemingway themes!!!
http://www.thekoffer.com/
Greetinx from Austria
eliZZZa
July 3rd | #
Hi there,
Just wanted to say that even though there will álways be people that are that blunt with their questions, it shouldn’t be something that you should be offended by. Of course it’s your theme, and it’s your way of saying “thank you” to the WP-community.
But people like that will be around in all aspects of work: theme creation, website developement, you name it. Even a constructionworker will get questions that get in the way of his belief and work.
Just ignore those people as good as you can, and focus on the community itself :) While I don’t feel I’m a real part of the community (I do use WP and a theme with the copyright of the creator), I do feel that people in communities like this are usually very nice people with only one “problem”… they tend to get too attached to the web-, WP- or designcommunity itself. That’s not neccesarily a bad thing, untill you start noticing the “bad” mails more then the “good” ones :)
So, heads up, and take a look at your comments, well-ment emails and the rest of the wonderfull community out there ;)
July 14th | #
Kyle,
You feel how you feel ,with reasons for which most of us can certainly relate. It isn’t my place to encourage you to keep going or agree to take time out, but I will proudly state that I have always, always admired you.
You have been more than generous to the WP Community and a true elder, no pun intended, for growing designers and developers who use your works as inspiration. As sacred as our hand-made creations are to us, we are each aware that it opens many devious doors. Unfortunately, no matter how generous we are, or become, there is little respect for creators these days. I think that’s pretty freakin’ sad.
One thing that cannot be denied is the fact that Hemingway was/is the white whale of WP. A creation that stood apart from cookie-cutter, clutter creations and inspired us all to learn and grow.
It was Hemingway, alone, that turned me from the mess of b2evo to WP years ago.
So, regardless of what you decide - remember how much you are admired. The real WP community adores you and will support you no matter which road you take.
Your generosity will not be forgotten.
God Bless.
August 8th | #
I haven’t been up to anything recently. My life’s been really boring lately.
Whatever. Today was a complete loss. Basically nothing seems important.
August 20 | #
I’ve just been staying at home waiting for something to happen.
I haven’t gotten much done lately.
My life’s been completely bland lately, but so it goes. Not much on my mind these days.
August 27th | #
While in my mind I might like to think of myself as a developer, I’m really more of an enthusiastic user who has figured out ways to do development to meet my needs. I’m one of those folks who end up having a lot of questions. And I hope I’m one that always showed my appreciation.
It always amazed me, both on the former Hemingway forums and others, how unappreciative folks would be — complaining about something that someone had done for them for free.
When I was searching around last fall for blog themes, I stumbled upon Hemingway. It was unique and exciting, and I was thrilled to build a few simple sites with the them. And I was always appreciative of the support from the community.
I am sorry that the community did not show more appreciation. And I just wanted to say THANK YOU for your hard work and passion. It will continue to show through on the many themes using Hemingway.
September 3rd | #
Respect. Hemingway is probably the first and last “perfect” theme any blog will see. Thank you for the hard work.
September 17th | #
Hi all!
Very interesting information! Thanks!
G’night
September 27th | #
Hi! Thank you for creating a truly awesome theme. I know that you’ve put much effort in coming up with a theme of this quality and I do hope that you’d again find the inspiration in creating more awesome things. =)
October 1st | #
hi,
i am using hemingway on wordpress, i find it the theme with the slickest design. there is one thing i am missing, sidebars. dont say now its going to ruin it, i’d just like to try… :)
support forum link doesnt work.
any insight? help? please?
thanks!
p
October 17th | #
I know where your coming from and I feel your frustration.
I always exhaust the net, faq’s, download pages and read me files, before I resort to emailing the theme devloper which, to date has mean’t I’ve never needed to conatct the theme devloper.
I personally feel its a deeper problem of a general lack of brain usage and common sense.
October 26th | #
[...] post led me to Kyle’s rant about the WordPress community: I’m not going to lie: a lot of my disheartening comes from fellow “developers.” It all [...]
November 19th | #
Kyle,
Hemingway is a work of art. How many people mimic’d van gogh’s style? .. Im sure, people asked him about his technique in his day too, and, the poor bugger got so annoyed, that he cut off his ear to spite the public :)
Anyway mate, stay sold .. don’t lop off any body parts to .. to heck with the idiots.
Create, enjoy your creation, and revel in the appreciation that people bestow.
I look forward to your next great idea/theme.
Aali
November 22nd | #
[...] website’. We’ve seen announcements denouncing this sort of behavior, recently with the Hemingway theme designer disappointed in the wordpress theme culture. Once again greed has begun to destroy what was once so [...]
December 7th | #
hi kyle,
i was running a project website of collaborative arts for 8 years.
this website started in the stoneage of the web 1996. you can bet
that i know about all variations of user/guest comments.
the most funny one was: send me your sources a**.
you should be stronger than these users. they were asking the same questions for years. even if the answers were given for years in faq’s, mail, guidelines. they still sended mails. uff.
go ahead.
i use hemingway on my website. i love to play with the theme. to change, add, etc. it’s the best theme i found for my personal use. and the structure is in a way that even allows me to understand - even if it takes a while - how to change details. am still working with it.
it would be a sad decision to stop publishing cause of the users.
continue your work. ignore the disturbing ignorant user family. let them use what you invent, create, …
cheers
bernd
December 9th | #
[...] post led me to Kyle’s rant about the WordPress community: I’m not going to lie: a lot of my disheartening comes from fellow “developers.” It all [...]
December 9th | #
Hi, my life is so boring, thank god on sites like this. I’ve been trying to make a goog looking Wordpress blog but two months without luck. If someone has something decent, reply please.,..
December 12th | #
Frane, wordpress now offers a wide range of template pallete. I’m sure you’ll be able to find something in there that will look decent enough. Best regards, Mathiu
January 10th | #
hi,
i am currently using hemmingway and i love the simplicity! I just have one question. How do I make my 3rd column visible in the bottom? It won’t appear when I put my blogroll there. Please help. Thanks.
January 13th | #
Interesting Thread I like the Hemmingway theme it has great functionality and actually looks more Like a website not a blog I LIKE IT
January 13th | #
The Hemmingway theme is great I Like the website look well done for giving back to the community .
February 24th | #
Amy Jo didn’t answer, but moaned divine and unofficial as her philosophers were chewed by the ok blonde bitch!
March 22nd | #
So how exactly DO you remove the copyrights?
Just kidding, good post.
March 23rd | #
First off, this comment is probably going to seem out of the blue.
But I’d like to thank you for creating the layout that you were scorning and cursing the birth of in ‘07. Because you see, I was dying to find something or at least a tutorial with the bloody bottom bar that I kept seeing all over.
Then I saw Hemingway.
Your theme was my main reason for even bothering with Wordpress and I know I’m using one of the four versions I downloaded in all of its unedited glory.
So once again. Thank you! Meanwhile, I’m going to poke around the code guts and make this theme kowtow to it’s borrowing master.
April 2nd | #
I have to say this is great
I have several takes on the hemmingway theme awesome job on your themes here this is so helpful for the free community so good to see people like you giving Back it makes up for all those that dont
Kind regards
Bill Bailey
June 29th | #
Hey!
There’s a great theme that you created. It’s your work of art. Some people will understand it, and some wont. But all like it.
Grow up mate. If you say you built this theme for people - well, the coders don’t really need YOU to build a free theme and circulate it. Don’t mock people mate. You just took all the fizz out of your theme. I love it, but I now don’t really think that as a person you’re any nice, so i won’t use it.
I’m sure you stopped replying to emails a long time ago. That’s fine. But setting up a post to mock at all? I think that’s taking it a little too far. It’s people like you who want others to love you. You’ll get it, but it won’t be unconditional. You had it, and now you’ve lost it. Think about it. You’ve just come a full circle after getting something great.
Just a few thoughts.
Cheers!
July 4th | #
Hemingway is brilliant. I found a way in Typepad to fudge something of a Hemingway look. On two of my wordpress blogs I use Hemingway straight up no chaser and am more than happy to have the correct attribution show.
An aside:
One of my paintings showed up in a cheap evangelical Christian film without my permission and without correct attribution. The husband of the wife of the sister who bought the painting is credited as the artist and while the painting is done in acrylic the credits mistakenly call it oil paint. I consulted a lawyer friend who said the most that can be done is to send a letter to the film company noting the error, telling them that all future copies of the film must be made with the correct attribution. I rather the damn film just died out.